5 non-lethal ammo types
There are a couple of different philosophies regarding how to handle a home intruder. One is shoot to kill, no questions asked. The thought here is that if an uninvited person is in my home at 2 a.m., I have to assume that he is there to rob me at the very least and very possibly to abduct, rape or kill my family members. Therefore, this person has already forfeited his rights to a fair beat down, and I’m not going to waste my sympathy on a home intruder who is killed in the act.
The other philosophy is, I don’t want to kill anyone, even a burglar. If I use lethal force, there’s no undoing it. If I find out later that the person was mentally handicapped and had no idea where he was or what he was doing, I can’t bring him back to life again. Same for an unarmed teenager who was badly influenced by his peers. And if, God forbid, one of my bullets misses the mark, passes through a wall and hits my wife or one of my kids, I could never forgive myself.
Check out this discussion including information on non-lethal ammo that might take down an intruder without resulting in his family making funeral arrangements.
Probably the best reason to use live ammo rather than non-lethal ammo is because you might end up further infuriating an intruder rather than incapacitating him. But if you live with family members and aren’t too crazy about bullets penetrating walls and interior doors, non-lethal ammo may be the best option for you. If that’s what you decide to go with, here are five possibilities for you:
- Rubber bullets – Won’t penetrate the skin, but will leave nasty welts that will require medical attention.
- Wax bullets – These could penetrate the skin at close range or if they strike a sensitive body part.
- Plastic bullets – Used by police for riot control. Also used for target practice.
- Electric bullets – Metal or rubber bullets that release an electrical charge when they hit a target, much like a Taser or other shock weapon.
- Bean Bag Rounds – Designed to incapacitate the target and leave large welts but not penetrate the skin.
What kind of experience do you have with non-lethal bullets? Have they been effective at incapacitating a target or have they only made the situation worse? Would you even consider using non-lethal bullets against a home invader? Would love to hear from you on this subject.
Thou Shalt not kill ! No one in their right mind wants to kill ! Unless you are absolutely sure you have too and I can tell you,you have no time once in this position unless you have a backup.to cover you while perhaps reloading or repositioning yourself or covering for another?. If you are alone and involved in a gangland situation you know your situation and WHY ! However if you live in a situation as we do today,with the threat of Breakins and confiscation of your property. You better believe that is the Enemy. Never before has the United States Government come this far in putting the citizens of America in this situation. Robbery, YES the Carpetbaggers stretched the law. Most of us know we have been robbed continually by government ! Now they want to use Weapons and more than guns if they have too. When they do, We the people forgot or do not realize we the people are the government. Our second Amendment gives us the right to Arms to protect our family and lives. they the intruder now become the enemy. We have the right to kill all who have intent to destroy us in any way. So they come in force to overwhelm us and kill us if need be to satisfy their Satistic Desire. I personally will fight to the death ! As for my country and if they knowing they have every means to use to kill me, will do just that but I know where I am going after Death ! I will live even after Death ! You will find me at Bay Pines Cemetary or Bushnell? PS I will take out all that I am able too. ……Felix
This is the first blog I have read getting responses from mostly folks not trained in firearm usage. Great to see the comments from that viewpoint. Obviously not biased for or against guns. Our kids started shooting at age 5 and have never stopped. All have carry permits and carry. Apartment protected by ADT is great. But, remember, when seconds count, police are just minutes away.
Is there truly a non-lethal round fired from a firearm? I am not asking for information, I am asking for deeper thought. A lot depends on the range from the firearm. Even blanks can kill at close range (remember the actor Jon-Erik Hexum killed 30 yrs ago). Plastic bullets can certainly be lethal at close range under the right (or wrong) circumstances. Bean bag rounds, especially from a shotgun at close range, can provide enough force to cause lethal injuries from cardiac dysrhythmias. And what is the legal take on shooting someone with a “non-lethal round”? A prosecutor might argue that there is questionable fear for one’s life if you do not feel the need to possibly kill the attacker/intruder. Indeed, shooting someone at all is hard to justify in my mind, unless there is truly a valid concern for the safety of self or another individual. The legal defense is of course to stop the attack; but if there is no attack, or significant threat thereof, any shooting may not be defensible. Castle Doctrine in many states does allow the owner/occupant to protect against an intruder, but is not a blanket of all protection. And it will have no protection against a civil suit. My personal philosophy is this. For concealed carry or at home I keep a good, commercially loaded self defense manstopper like Hydra-Shok, Golden Saber, Critical Defense, etc. If I feel the need to shoot, it will be for keeps. An intruder at home gets the option to leave by the closest exit, being advised of such, as well as being told the police are enroute (cell phone kept by the gun) and that I am armed. A move in any other direction is considered a threat and treated accordingly.
Why isn’t anybody talking about powder activated Pepper spray double barrel pistol available from Kimber Mfg. non-lethal is my best choice. It shoots a 5 ft’ circle of pepper spray at 19 ft. This is not a squirt gun, it’s fast and will penetrate even a ski mask. anyway check it out they have two models, one two shot disposable, the other has replaceable double barrels, anyway check out their web site for more information. I own both models.
Incapacitate first, then if you find out they are a ‘liberal’-FINISH THEM OFF!
The correct approach is shoot to stop. This is what Frontsight teaches. Too many of these comments sound like “oh good I get to shoot someone.”
many years ago i bought a 20 ga and cut off down to leagle lenth // i think it’s a good house gun // not much for hunting but i’ve never had to use it
I believe that the entire concept of non-lethal rounds for a private citizen defending themselves, and their loved ones is totally bogus!
I love the comment above: “I would not want to be caught using non-lethal force and find they were packing lethal force.”
If someone is found in your house uninvited, they are by definition “up to no good” and as far as I am concerned (as-well-as the law in every state I know of in the United States of America) one, being “in fear for their life (or the life of their family)” has every right (and I would daresay responsibility) to shoot to kill.
In this situation (even if someone feinted confusion, mental illness or being lost) you have no idea if that is the case or not, but chances are you came upon them unexpectedly after they broke in and they are “playing you for a sucker” until they can compromise your defensive/combat advantage by attempting to maneuver you into a position where their friends, who broke in with them, can disarm & defeat (read kill) you.
You are your family’s best first and last defense. Never compromise that defense by even considering “non-lethal” rounds in a home invasion situation – what on earth are you thinking?
Also, if you are not committed to using “deadly lethal force” to defend yourself or your loved ones, then you should certainly never have a firearm in the house in the first place!
If you are concerned about your aim, then practice, practice, practice until you are proficient, and if your wife is your backup, make sure that she shares your responsible attitude and knows how to shoot too. There are training facilities such as Front Sight that can help you in this regard.
If you are concerned about the bullet going through walls to injure a family member, then there are projectiles (such as a glaser safety slug, etc.) that can be used for this, however, standard combat ammunition (Federal Hydra-Shok, Federal HST, Hornady Critical Defense, etc.) should be suitable for your home defense needs.
I raised a child and had firearms in the house as my father did with me. So having children is no excuse whatsoever in leaving yourself vulnerable and undefended. There are modern quality biometric safes (not my favorite, but they work) that can be used to safeguard loaded firearms from prying fingers, however, we didn’t have any such thing in my family when I grew up (and neither did my child), and believe me, accessing dad’s firearms without permission was never, ever an option (even though I knew where both the gun and the ammunition were at all times from as early as I can remember).
In regards to the person’s comment regarding being okay with a slingshot or bow & arrow, but not with a firearm, I will say this: “killing in an act of self-defense is killing, no matter how it is done.” There is a saying, “don’t take a knife to a gun fight.” Again, if you are defending either your life or the life of those you love, whom you are the protector for, why would you choose a “weapon of lesser choice.” This reminds me of the introduction of (I believe) Scary Movie 3 where the blonde bimbet selects a banana as a weapon and chooses certain death instead of life. I recommend that you re-assess your values in this regard if you have others relying on you for their protection. If it is just you, well, then that is your choice.
A final comment, remember that a handgun (although convenient for concealability, ease of carry, and its advantage in confined spaces) is also the puniest firearm on the planet, and one’s defense (coupled with a strong light to turn darkness into light) is not relegated to something such as this. In close-quarters defense (especially for those who have not mastered a pistol), a shotgun (or other long-gun) may be a better choice, depending on one’s training and comfort level.
I live in the country, in NY State, where handguns are as easy to get as hen’s teeth. While walking in the woods, I encountered a man with a handgun. He pointed it at me and told me to “Get down and don’t scream”. Luckily, I had let my Golden Retriever accompany me off leash. He’d been in the brush, sniffing out a bird. He heard my scream and ran from the brush, attacked the gunman, and I grabbed the handgun which had fallen when the dog bit onto his arm. I aimed the gun, fired once at the attacker’s belt, wiped the gun, tossed it beside the gunman and ran to call the cops. I told them that I had found this man in the woods, obviously injured. I was questioned, but never charged. The man was a known rapist, out on parole. He was arrested for parole violation and sent back to complete the last 10 yrs. of a 20 year sentence.
I have the judge, it goes with 45 colt or 4/10. First round is 7 1/2 target shot 4/10, second is #6, third is 000, forth is a1/8 oz slug, last is a 45 colt. The first two will hurt a lot but won’t kill. The spread on the small shot is about 8 feet at 12 feet distance.
I feel, if someone breaks into your home, You have the right to protect yourself with any means available. I have a lot of weapons at home. I myself am a weapon. If you are a survivor, you need to be ready with anything and be able to turn anything into a weapon. The kitchen is great for weapons. If you keep a 22″ machete near, That is an excellent weapon. If someone breaks into your house and you chop them across the neck with your machete. That will most likely stop almost anybody. If you cut off there arm and chop the neck they will probably die within 5 mins. I’m a survivor, I will do anything necessary to save my family and my life, that’s how you should be. If the stores stop selling food what will you expect from your neighbors? They will turn into Zombies. I have seen people turn into Zombies and it’s not good to see. That’s why you have to also be drastic If you want to survive. I am not recommend anything to anybody nor am I telling anybody to do anything. But when the SHTF, I will be a survivor. I think people have to do what ever it takes if you want to be a survivor. If i sound drastic i’m sorry, but just think about the worst scenario and what would you do? Just imagine total chaos, No police, no phone, just people coming to steel anything and everything you have, That’s you or them? When you find your answer, I might not be so Drastic.
I do not to think of myself as a survivor, someone who is attacked and lives but is paralyzed for life is a survivor. I am a victor who WILL do what is necessary to not survive but be victorious and protect both my families and my own life.
A paint ball gun can overwhelm an intruder. Some can fire up to 100 or more shots very quickly. It would be nice if you could get paint balls containing something more painful to the intruder than just paint. Even a vital dye to mark him for a few days like banks use. A sticky substance that turns into something like spider web… open to ideas..
The Feral Government has pepper spray paint balls, but they are much too expensive for mere peons to obtain.
Freeze some paintballs
I would not want to be caught using non-lethal force and find they were packing lethal force.
That’s a good point!
EXCELLENT point!!!
I am a senior with health issues. I live alone, except for 2 cats and 1 little and 1medium sized dog. She will on command go for what is between a man’s legs if he were to attack me. She is my security system. However, i do own a Glock 19 and I am a very good shot. I’m not afraid to use it.
I really didn’t know you could get non lethal ammo, but that’s what I’m doin also, as the gentleman said he does, first round, non l eathal, if I fire again! Well that’s all folks!!
I have used bird shot as my first round for years. My wife keeps bird shot in hers when walking the dog. She has had to use it more than once when coming across a snake, which does happen out here in the desert once in a great while.
I have a 6 year old son in my home so right now a loaded firearm is not an option. I do have other lethal and non-lethal means of dealing with intruders though. I wouldn’t advise anyone living in Southern California of shooting an intruder though. I made that mistake back in 1974 when a known rapist kicked my front door off the hinges and entered my apartment with the intent of raping my wife before killing her, the guy told me this just before I gave him both barrels of 12GA 3″ magnum 00 buckshot to the mid section. I thought “end of problem”. The cops arrested me for 1ST degree murder. I was tried and the jury found me not guilty and I left the state a month later. I have been back for visits because my dad still lives there but I won’t live there again!
Cops are usually much more dangerous than any criminal.
Call 911 and get a armed psychopath delivered to your door.
Sorry but you break into my house and i have the chance you are going to pay the ultimate price me and my family always come first 2 always loaded guns and family knows how to use them
I live in an apartment by myself with only one door and a patio window. The patio window is locked and protected by ADT as well as the front door. I have a 90 grain bullets that are frarmented for my 9mm handgun. That means they do not expand until they come into contact with soft tissue. If they hit a wall or other obstruction, they fragment into pieces. They will not richochet. I would hate to kill or maim a person, but if it comes down to my life against theirs, I will shoot to protect my life. It would be nice to be able to read an intruder’s mind to tell if they are mentally incapable and do not know where they are or if the intruder is a person bent on violence towards whomever is in the home. I will always shoot to protect my life. If you don’t, you are just digging a grave for yourself.
WOW!! I have learned so much here!! I have been reading f some of these aloud to my older children. It has been our concern how to stay protected but not leave a loaded weapon around; we have small boys in the home, so this is a real concern. I likely will sound stupid, but… Better to ask a dumb question then not to ask at all, so here goes…. 1) What is the best way of keeping fire arms handy for our safety, 2) How do our children protect themselves, 3) How do we have the fire arms there, with easy access, without having them also easily accessible to the ‘bad guy’, 4) How to we protect our family with loaded fire arms or weapons with ammo in close proximity, without undo danger of little boys playing and possibly getting their hands on them and hurting themselves or others, 5) What is the rule if our children do shoot someone else- a. In playing OR b. In defending our home(one of our older teens)?? We have USCCA, does that cover only the adults or does that cover children as well; not to sound less informed, but… My his husband purchased the membership, does it correctly cover both of us, as husband & wife? Does it cover out he, as in if there was another adult in our home, when we were not home, & they were responsible for our children & the home, would they be covered under our policy? OR could we still end up liable?? Please advise, if you know the legally accurate answer. Thank you for anyone who can answer the other above questions??
Melanie. I don’t truck with uninformed persons having access to guns – no matter what the age. If you want to have guns in your home (even unloaded and locked in a cabinet) your children (and YOU) need to have full firearm training. I would recommend even to the competitive level. You want to kids to think of the guns as a tool and not as a shiney symbol of power. I also believe that until their brains are fully developed (between age 18-20) that children *cannot* make sound choices about using lethal force. They can. not. do it. OK?
Also you are paying good money for that Concealed Carry, aren’t you? They owe you a full and clear explanation of what you are paying for. Do not be too intimidated to demand a full understanding of your purchase straight from them.
Professional training for everyone is always the best start. Not only will everyone learn to properly handle firearms, but also to store them. In addition, it is a great family event that all seem to love participating in.
I love the idea of families doing this together for so many reasons, and competitions really level up the fun. Few things I have done for my family have been so worthwhile and brought us closer. Now training grandkids and they are having a blast while learning how to safely and properly being around firearms. 8 year old especially likes her pink Savage 22!
It would be great if you could get links to the vendors or manufacturers of the 5 non-lethal loads described which show the effects of each of their products much the same way we see the effects of a live taser test.
Another consideration is “Snake Load”. Basically, a round with bird shot in a plastic slug. Not really an option for most semi-autos but great in a revolver. I can pop that first round into a wall, the floor or the intruder without concern for collateral damage – no penetrating power. My second round is lethal. It is very unlikely that a BB will hit anywhere that could cause a lethal result.
Wasp spray to the eyes. can be sprayed for 30 Feet and the pain an inability to see is an advantage to the home owner.
I would be careful about spreading the myth about wasp spray. Some studies have shown that it is not as an effective incapicatant as OC (Oleeocapsicum)pepper spray. I’d trust my personal protection to something like “Inferno” over wasp spray any day.
For my own personal reasons, I do not own a firearm. However, I have no problem with a crossbow or a wrist rocket.
A wrist rocket with a scattering of hex nuts can be very painful. If you aim for the face, it can do nasty non lethal damage.
Sorry buy you won’t stop an intruder with a slingshot I the middle of the night when it’s dark
where would one acquire such ammonition?
Ryte necks-door to the skool that teeches speling!!! ;o)
i have both the first round is non lethal but # 2 you are dead in my revolver and in my shotgun if the first one doesn’t stop them number two will
A second person account of lethal responce.. A coworker on coming home entering by front door surprised three men exiting by rear door stealing 2 of his 3 choppers from inside his home —grabbing a 12 ga. from wall mount by the door shot the leg off the last man out the door .. the police who responded told him if the leg had fallen outside the door he would have been arrested. his bikes were recovered from out of state . He was late for work that day…